Trump promises border wall 'soon, way ahead of schedule'

1,900 miles of wall that most people can dig under, cut through, or pole-vault over. Sure, it makes perfect sense. Conservatives have always had a true talent for utterly wasting large sums of money on foolhardy schemes. What's next, another Star Wars defense? Shhhh don't tell Donnie...

 

Obamacare worked well.

And don't look now, but China is all over Star Wars.

Trump's wall is chock full of the latest and greatest detection devices known to man. Tia Maria won't know what hit her.

 

That is simply not true........but you knew that before you posted

 

A bill is what congress passes in order for the federal government to take action. Without a bill, the question becomes how much discretionary spending authority the executive branch has.


The amount each illegal costs America is an interesting figure, because if it is $X then if one person manages to get into America by crossing the border illegally in a way in which the wall would have stopped that person, then America has to pay $X. The problem I see with the dollars is that people seem to think the wall is justified by the total we spend on ALL those already here, but that is just wrong. The wall makes no difference to those already here.

So, the question becomes one of how many are coming in. And, for that we have several sources that say the number of undocumented aliens in America is not increasing. So, THIS reason for building a wall means (0 undocumenteds added) times $X per undocumented = $0 saved by even a perfect wall.

Maybe we can also try to justify the cost of the wall by reducing the border patrol cost of today. But, I've seen no suggestion that would happen.

And, let's remember that there are OTHER ways to come into America. Nearly half of the undocumented population that lives here today came with a visa, legally, and then overstayed. A wall would do NOTHING to stop that. So, the wall can't be more than about 50% effective - something that should be remembered when calculating how much the wall would save us.

Also, there are other borders. People in Mexico often pay "coyotes" substantial amounts to cross the border. Coyotes can use any way in - boats, air, or whatever.

And, let's remember that these people come here to find work. When the Bush crash occurred, the number of those coming in went to ZERO!!! So, the bill that just about passed congress would have required employers to use a fixed version of e-verify, with policing, in order to deny jobs - which probably would be about like the situation that stopped people from running our border.



I'm saying that we have to justify the wall on the basis of what it actually would stop and whether that method is both the most effective and cheapest approach.

I think the wall loses on ALL those measures.

 

So, we're building the wall because of some problem that MIGHT occur?

Seriously??? We're so short on ways to spend tens of billions of dollars that we're trying to guess what might happen in the future??

No. That makes no sense.

Plus, the wall only addresses one land border. It doesn't address other ways in, such as visas (which have accounted for nearly HALF of those here now). So, predicting that a wall would be more than 50% effective is nonsense - we already have data on that.


I'd point out that the bi-partisan immigration reform bill included visa improvements and installing a robust e-verify system, which would seriously reduce the attractiveness of America as a destination.

 

Let's say there are drastic cost overruns and the wall costs $50 billion. The US spends $99 billion every single year on illegal aliens. Can you understand the math.

 

lol - so, you said "no" and accused me of something.

You're going to have to do better than that.

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Yes.

Here's the deal:

The wall will make ZERO difference in the $99 billion that you claim we spend every year on illegal aliens.

Can you see why?

 

Because, along with all the other measures you mentioned, deporting them, and more, it will all but eliminate those costs.

 

No, we're talking about justifying the wall.

The wall won't deport anyone. It will not reduce the cost of those here in any way.


(Also, we could discuss the accounting for those who are here, by the way. So, you will notice that I have not accepted your numbers on that. And, we are NOT going to deport 12 million people to Mexico any time soon.)

 

It will prevent even more from simply walking across the border and gaming the system. Derp.

 

You really think they just walk across the border?

 

You really think they don't?

 

Exactly.

That is ALL it can do. So, THAT is the number of illegal immigrants that must justify the wall.

So, how big is THAT number???

Today, several sources report that THAT number is ... zero.

http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2016/11/03/5-facts-about-illegal-immigration-in-the-u-s/

Also, remember that:
- there are other routes in. So, the wall can't even be counted on to cut the number coming here in half. So, if there is ever a time when undocumented aliens really want to come here, the wall is HALF a solution, and no more.

- there are other methods of stopping these people from coming here illegally, such as revamping our visa program and implementing and enforcing e-verify, remembering that undocumented aliens stopped coming here when jobs dried up.



Again, there just isn't a valid justification for the wall. The numbers just don't add to the estimated tens of billions of tax dollars.

That should be GOOD NEWS!!!

Thank the LORD we don't have to pay that taxes!!

 

Good for Trump.

 

No they don't. If it was so easy why do they pay thousands to people to help them get here?

 

Whine until the sun don't shine. The wall will be built.

BTW, you did not take into account those who would be deported and re-cross.

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Do these people catapult them across the border?

 

Why don't you tell me. You know everything. Tell me how far down are they building this wall?

 

The wall will be built. Mexico will pay for it.

 

That didn't answer the question.

 

That settles all questions.

 

Only if you have your lips fastened to Donald's (*)(*)(*)(*).

 

I think you can write WIN here.

 

These landmines were designed to defeat heavy armor...

...but I bet they would work just as well against illegal invaders.

(turn volume down)

[video=youtube;ReeymNBk02I]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ReeymNBk02I[/video]

 

Why don't we shoot down planes full of refugees too while we are at it?

 

You're supposed to throw up the sarcastic quotation marks when you call them "refugees".

Example: This plane was carrying "refugees".

[video=youtube;-rdOib31uLQ]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-rdOib31uLQ[/video]