Was bathing on the rooftop under the King's window commonplace in King David's time?

Did Muhammed call for stoning or did some hadith call for stoning? Also, where were the four witnesses?

 

Contemporary archaeologists in Israel are no long convinced there was ever a united kingdom nor are they convinced of the Exodus.. They think the 'Israelites' were just another tribe of Canaanites.

 

From what I've read, the Bible supports the idea of stoning women under certain circumstances. Mohamed was like, "yeah, lets do this thing" but as a hierarchy in Judaism evolved, they thought, "bad idea". So Mohamed said, "guys, it is in your book... look!" they supposedly opened the book, and, not kidding, put a thumb over the part about stoning women and said, "nope, nothing to see there". They didn't want to do so anymore, while Mohamed was... less flexible on the issue.

 

That's misrepresenting what happened. The kingdom of Israel started getting very lax with sexual things. It started from the top.
Thereafter they were occupied by foreign governments and under the customs and laws of other cultures (Persian, Greek, Roman).
Middle Eastern culture stoned women. In fact they still do in some remote more isolated parts of the Middle East, and even if they do not actually stone them anymore, in some of the Gulf states that type of mentality is still there.

I think the issue was that no man wants to be cuckolded. And many men viewed a woman who had been defiled by another man as totally worthless, so might as well stone her.
Read Esther 1:16-20 to get some idea about the Persian views on this.

 

Does Esther 1:16 mention Mohamed's visit to the Jews who put a thumb over the relevant part of the page he's noting to say they should be stoning women? If so, I'll read that. Otherwise, I'm thinking someone was writing about something in the Hadith, as the story is about Mohamed, not about his teachings. I could be wrong.

Would it be correct to write that the Old Testament authorizes stoning women, while today's Jews are against that? EDIT: Islam and Stoning: https://quotingislam.blogspot.com/2011/06/muhammad-ordered-stoning.html EDIT: on Stoning.. https://www.gotquestions.org/Bible-stoning.html EDIT: Not finding the relevance https://www.biblestudytools.com/esther/1-16.html

 

So there's no sura just cute stories.

 

I read it a long time ago so, no, I don't know the Sura. Is there a material part to the story you doubt? Islam, Judaism and stoning? Current Jewish mores on stoning? Islamic nations' position on this? EDIT: https://quotingislam.blogspot.com/2011/06/muhammad-ordered-stoning.html reads that the Jew actually put a hand on the Torah. Volume 8, Book 82, Number 809: On that, Ibn Salam said to the Jew, "Lift up your hand." Behold! The Divine Verse of the Rajam was under his hand. So Allah's Apostle [Muhammad] ordered that the two (sinners) be stoned to death, and so they were stoned.

 

That's simply Bible teaching, Both Israel and Judah were conquered for defying stronger powers. The Assyrians conquered Israel when they joined other nation to oppose Assyria. Judah was conquered by Babylonia when they signed a pact with Egypt against Babylon.

 

I never could stand the story about Queen Vashti.. No descent woman would dance for an all male party that had lasted for days. She didn't wrong the king or any of the princes by being a virtuous woman.

 

No mention of the four required witnesses?

This site promotes hate and ignorance. Scroll down to the bottom of the page.

https://quotingislam.blogspot.com/2011/06/muhammad-ordered-stoning.html

 

The list of other sites they state are helpful?
What about four witnesses? I've heard that if a woman accuses a man of rape, she needs either a man, or 4 female witnesses to back up her testimony. Is that to which you are referring?

 

I heard a historian once say that the story of David and Bathsheba is unique in world history in that a prophet of God denounced the king of the nation in his own palace, to his face, without consequence. No other nation or culture would have preserved such a story intact.

 

I'll give you a similar warning as you got about Wyrd... Margot2 is a shill for Islam and lies and obscures the truth about Mohammed and the Koran. I wouldn't take her word on anything.

 

Its a whole collection of hate sites.

She needs 4 male witnesses.

 

Don't be ridiculous.. There is no reason for me to slander Jews or Muslims.. Just stick with the facts.

 

These days, we do not know who to trust. The Legacy media has always been biased. Now they are completely obedient. I think an information source may be hateful, but still be reporting something that is correct. This one has links to backup what it is writing about but they may be just as suspect. It is hard to know who and what to trust in these matters.

 

Let's please not try to derail this thread with a discussion about Islam or outrageous slanderous accusations about Judaism/Christianity.

This thread is about David/Bathsheba. Let's please try to stick with the topic.

 

Why? The incident fits into the story of David and his sins nicely. In later episodes in the era of the Kings God's prophets often remonstrate with the king - in private and in public. Nothing strange about it at all. We are not talking about history or historians, We are talking about an historical novel.

 

Like it or not, the Israelites wrote it down as history, not fiction. Whether you think it's fiction or not is irrelevant.

 

The number and gender of witnesses vary, depending on the issue =
https://quran.com/24/1-11
https://quran.com/24/10-20
https://quran.com/2/282?translations=21,20,19,17,101,95,85,84,22,18
https://quran.com/4/15-25?translations=20
https://quran.com/24/8?translations=18

The interesting thing is that a person can take the place of four witnesses if the person swears four times to Allah. In contrast, the Jesus character says that a person should never swear an oath.

 

Bye.

 

there is truth to this

 

Where's the evidence that David - as recorded in the Bible - actually existed? Study the story of David as recorded in the Bible and understand the history and background of the time. It's greatly exaggerated. The real king of that era was Omri - ignored by the writers in the 7th century because he was a pagan. The Jews in Babylon had no history or origin further back than the era of the Kings. So they made one up adapting earlier creation stories myths. They used known events like the walls of Jericho falling - Jericho being in an earthquake region its walls had fallen several times in its 9,000 year history.- the fall of the 5 cities of the plain and used knowledge of the cities like UR and Egyptian cities to weave the early stories of Abraham, Moses etc. -Many Jews are now accepting that these stories are just allegories. Jewish figures show that 50% of Jews no worldwide no longer practise.their religion because of this.

By the way Jericho was shaken by an earthquake again in the 12th century CE and in 1926. This MIGHTY city was no bigger than a village. You could walk round it's walls in about 10-15 minutes.

Margot is no shill for Islam. She has a lot of knowledge having lived in the M.E. and toured widely. She and I have crossposted for years.You should be careful of your accusations and apologise.

 

Again, irrelevant. The Israelites considered the Bible as a factual account of their own history, which is why I brought up the historian talking about the story of David and the prophet. You can pretty much explain everything in the Bible in natural terms, but that doesn't change the fact that the Israelites believed it.

Her knowledge of Islam is purely anecdotal and doesn't square with what dozens of actual experts on Islam like Daniel Pipes say about it. It also doesn't square with what dozens of Imams say about it, many of whom you can watch on YouTube with English subtitles. I stand by my statement.

 

Ah yes. Daniel Pipes. Anti Islam radicalist.

To me, every fundamentalist Muslim, no matter how peaceable in his own behavior, is part of a murderous movement and is thus, in some fashion, a foot soldier in the war that bin Laden has launched against civilization.

Israelis must be encouraged to defeat the Palestinians

The increased stature, and affluence, and enfranchisement of American Muslims...will present true dangers to American Jews.

• Speech to the American Jewish Congress (October 21, 2001).

Of course the Israelites BELIEVED it . It was ingrained in them by the Religious hierarchy of the time. That's why Jesus the preacher believed it. Jews today are questioning much of the OT. That's why they are leaving their religion. Zionism is taking over in Israel.

A shill is a person who praises or promotes something because they secretly have a personal stake in it.

You don't even know who Margot is. She has no stake in Islam. She comments on Islam as I, an atheist, comment on the Bible. Your comment is untrue and demands an apology.