Was bathing on the rooftop under the King's window commonplace in King David's time?

Palestine was never a province of Syria. It was a province in three empires. It wasn't a province at the time of the Babylonian exodus.

 

HISTORY OF SYRIA AND PALESTINE - historyworld.net
www.historyworld.net/wrldhis/PlainTextHistories.asp?historyid=ab29
Syria and Palestine: from the 6th century BC. The Roman rulers are not the first to link Syria administratively with Palestine. In the late 6th century Darius makes Syria and Palestine, together with Cyprus, the fifth satrapy of his empire. During the Seleucid dynasty Syria and Palestine are under joint control in the 2nd century.

 

The Jews of Babylon were not from the tribe of Judah, they were from the Kingdom of Judah.

Judea was not the southern part of Palestine and the place of exile was not Iraq - and France had never been a part of Gaul. The name Palestine came later, probably with Herodotus in the 5th century BCE, but Jews never called their country Palestine.

How are the Amarna Letters relevant to the topic?

There were heretic Jewish sects, even Jewish Gnostics. There were the oral tradition (rejected by Samaritans) and the mystic tradition (known today as Kabbalah). There were different religious schools with different interpretations of the Jewish Law (Shammai and Hillel are the most famous). Not all Jews thought and acted alike.

Only someone who doesn't know a thing about Judaism can say that Jesus (if he existed) was an observant Jew who taught Judaism in Judea. The Christian tradition follows the Septuagint, an heretic version of the Tanakh not used in Judea. The New Testament was originally written in Greek, not in Aramaic or Hebrew. Some events in the Gospels couldn't happen in Judea.

The goal of the parables is not to enlighten Jews, but to prevent outsiders from understanding the message. Early Christianity was probably a religion of mysteries, like many pagan religions, and the secrets were told only to a small group of initiates (which would explain why Peter didn't recognize the resurrected Jesus - the passage describes a failed initiation, maybe written by an adversary of Peter).

If you want to understand the Christian religion, you need to look at the big picture - the religions and cultures of various countries and communities around the Mediterranean at the time of the supposed life of Jesus. Judaism alone can't provide the needed answers.

 

And the Kingdom of Judah was named after ??????

Regardless when Palestine was named, it is used to define the area talked about.
Most Jews were of the old tradition. You're simply using the educated section of society. Most of this did not come down to the ordinary people nor did they care. This happens in all society. How many Tennis club members know any more than they need to simply play the game. Most Christians are happy to take basics and leave it at that.

If you are not sure that Jesus existed, how can you comment on what he is supposed to have said. Using the Bible the teacher spoke, lived and preached Judaism as the people knew it.

The goal of the parables is not to enlighten Jews, but to prevent outsiders from understanding the message There were no gentiles when he spoke if you believe the Bible. He spoke only to the Jews.

That Christianity is a religion formed from earlier beliefs is obvious. Greek philosophy plays quite a part. as does Judaism. Judaism is a mixture of earlier religions, ad infinitum.

(which would explain why Peter didn't recognize the resurrected Jesus - the passage describes a failed initiation, maybe written by an adversary of Peter). Sheer speculation.

 

The Kingdom of Judah was formed on the territories of the tribes of Judah, Simon, and Benjamin. Descendants of refugees from other tribes from the former northern kingdom of Israel lived there as well. The kingdom may have been named after Judah, but it was home to members of other tribes as well.

I beg to differ. The name Palestine is too politically charged. I'd accept the "region later named Palestine" wording though.

I think religion played a far more important role then than today. I also think that most people used to worship gods of several religions.

I'm quite sure that the Jesus of the Gospels never existed. He was the god of one or several sects. Many early Christians were Gnostics, and their recently discovered gospels reveal a totally different non-human - and certainly not Jewish - Jesus.
http://gnosis.org/naghamm/nhl.html

Georges Ory suggests that the Jesus of the canonical Gospels is a hybrid between the god and one or more Jewish rebel leaders in the Galilee at the beginning of the first century CE.

I'm not commenting on what Jesus is supposed to have said. i'm commenting on what the Jesus character was made to say.

The canonical Gospels were not written for Jews, but for gentiles. No sane evangelist would have written in Greek for a Jewish readership in Judea. Therefore the parables were destined to gentile eyes and minds.

Anyway, by "outsiders" I mean those not initiated in the mysteries of the cult, be they Jews or Gentiles.

Then why is only Judaism taken into consideration when discussing Christian beliefs?

My opinion is based on the larger geographical, historical, and cultural context in which the evangelists lived and wrote. Religions of mystery were the norm. Initiates watched some sort of show depicting those actions of their god that they were supposed to understand and imitate for gaining access to eternal life. Revealing the secrets was strictly forbidden.

 

The Kingdom of Judah was formed on the territories of the tribes of Judah, Simon, and Benjamin. Descendants of refugees from other tribes from the former northern kingdom of Israel lived there as well. The kingdom may have been named after Judah, but it was home to members of other tribes as well.

I know all this. I've studied the Bible and history of the time. Judah was formed of Judah and Simeon. Benjamin was in the northern kingdom. After the fall of the north many survivors came south. Others stayed where they were.

I think religion played a far more important role then than today. I also think that most people used to worship gods of several religions

Not for the Jews of the time. They adhered to their beliefs with tenacity. That's why the Romans held them in esteem until the rebellion in 70AD. They were allowed privileges for their beliefs not allowed other nations. 3 times they complained to Rome about the actions against their faith/beliefs of Roman kings and Governors and each time Rome told the ruler to undo what he had done against the Jews to avoid trouble.

I'm quite sure that the Jesus of the Gospels never existed. He was the god of one or several sects. Many early Christians were Gnostics, and their recently discovered gospels reveal a totally different non-human - and certainly not Jewish - Jesus

I disagree. I'm certain that a man named Jesus existed. There is reference to him by ancients. I do not believe he was divine. We have evangelists today.who do the same as this man. The Gospels are written for Christianity.

The canonical Gospels were not written for Jews, but for gentiles. No sane evangelist would have written in Greek for a Jewish readership in Judea. Therefore the parables were destined to gentile eyes and minds.

But we are not talking about the time when the Gospels were written, or what the Gospels were written for. If Jesus existed it was to the Jews he was speaking. The Gospels were written decades after Jesus died. Yes, if you are right in the long term, but the Gospels are written in retrospect, not at the time of Jesus. That's why it is important to put the Gospels to one side while studying the time of Jesus. That's why I say that the Gospel writers put into the mouth of Jesus words that no Jew would ever say. It's simply a case of what actually happened in Jesus time and what the Gospel writers want people to believe. I don't believe for onbe moment that Jesus was associated with any pagan god. He was simply a man with a mission to his own.

Then why is only Judaism taken into consideration when discussing Christian beliefs?

Because from Judaism stem many of the characteristics of Christianity. As Judaism has taken much from the religious world in which it was formed, so has Christianity taken much from Judaism. Some Christian rituals actually stem back a 1000 years before even Judaism existed. Judaism used them and Christianity does today.
Christian Easter is an adaptation of an ancient ritual. The sun god, bringer of life, would descend into the underworld in autumn. In Spring he would return. It was celebrated by people gathering on a certain day. As the sun rose they would shout 'He is risen'.


You've quoted me as saying something that I did not say

 

By the time Christ was born there were more Jews living outside of Palestine than in it. There were large Jewish communities in Rome, Aleppo, Damascus, Persia, Alexandria, Elephantine Island, Anatolia and all around the Mediterranean ..

Early Christianity was JEWISH.. Gentiles were never the target audience of Jesus.

They (Judah) even despised the Samaritans.. considering them Hellenized, half breeds and fake Jews.

 

Much of the trouble in the Maccabean period was because many Jews had become Hellenized (English spelling) under Greek and Seleucid rule, Antiochus Epiphanes tried to perpetuate this when he profaned the Temple. He failed eventually and proved that the Jews were strong in their beliefs. Something Rome noted.

 

for comparison

 

I only mentioned there were members of different tribes in Judea because you said earlier that the Babylonian Jews at the time of the exile were of the tribe of Judah. Not likely.

You say:

Yes, but I was talking about the time of the Babylonian exile.

Let's agree to disagree.

Try reading some Gnostic gospels. It's a totally different Jesus, son to a totally different god.

You say:

Well...

Dionysus was the son of Zeus and the princess Semele (virgin birth, no man involved). He was hidden by his father because Zeus' jealous wife wanted to kill him (wasn't Jesus hidden to save his life?) He went to Egypt. He resurrected Ikarios. Dionysus descended into the world of the dead and brought his dead mother back to the world of the living (died, came back to life, brought mortal people back to life). He wore a long robe and a wreath of ivy leaves.

“Young man,
two are the forces most precious to mankind.
The first is Demeter, the Goddess.
She is the Earth -- or any name you wish to call her --
and she sustains humanity with solid food.
Next came Dionysus, the son of the virgin,
bringing the counterpart to bread: wine
and the blessings of life's flowing juices.
His blood, the blood of the grape,
lightens the burden of our mortal misery.
Though himself a God, it is his blood we pour out
to offer thanks to the Gods. And through him, we are blessed.”
― Euripides, The Bacchae

Isn't wine the blood of Jesus?

One tradition says that Demeter was Dionysus' mother, so there's the bread as the body of a divine creature.

There are many more sons of virgins and gods, some even crucified. See here:
https://www.sacred-texts.com/bib/cv/wscs/wscs10.htm

You say:

If all you look at is Judaism and Judea, and nothing else, all you'll see is Judaism and Judea. Look at the bigger picture.

 

Dionysus was the son of Zeus and the princess Semele (virgin birth, no man involved). He was hidden by his father because Zeus' jealous wife wanted to kill him (wasn't Jesus hidden to save his life?) He went to Egypt. He resurrected Ikarios. Dionysus descended into the world of the dead and brought his dead mother back to the world of the living (died, came back to life, brought mortal people back to life). He wore a long robe and a wreath of ivy leaves.

“Young man,
two are the forces most precious to mankind.
The first is Demeter, the Goddess.
She is the Earth -- or any name you wish to call her --
and she sustains humanity with solid food.
Next came Dionysus, the son of the virgin,
bringing the counterpart to bread: wine
and the blessings of life's flowing juices.
His blood, the blood of the grape,
lightens the burden of our mortal misery.
Though himself a God, it is his blood we pour out
to offer thanks to the Gods. And through him, we are blessed.”
― Euripides, The Bacchae

Isn't wine the blood of Jesus?

One tradition says that Demeter was Dionysus' mother, so there's the bread as the body of a divine creature.

There are many more sons of virgins and gods, some even crucified. See here:

But I'm not arguing that. That's down to Christianity's view of the Gospels. I don't think for one minute that Jesus was divine. Neither do I think he claimed it. It was the Gospel writers who make the claim. There's nothing to support that Jesus ever went to Egypt, or was hidden. These are all misquoted texts from the OT.

Back later. I have a Physio appointment.

 

Very late delay in replying. Sorry.

You used Euripedes. Fair enough. But Paul used Greek philosophy regularly in his formation of Christianity. This did not come from Judaism. Your website is very familiar to me. I know all about these.
Christianity is based on the belief that Jesus was God's Son. There's no evidence for that. Neither does Judaism accept it. Looking at Judaism and even Judea tells me about Judaism. Christianity is a different subject. A mixture of Hellenism and Christianity - formed by Paul. He does convert some Judaistic rituals etc into beliefs for Christianity. Some of those are also taken by Judaism from earlier beliefs.