Which Vision of America Will Win Out?

They are when comparing limited government to socialistic governing.

 

We're living in what will one day be considered notable times. The system is imploding, like it did in the USSR.

But Americans are resilient, and for the most part still believe in freedom. We'll come out of this better than before.

 

LOL. Sure.

You can look to Brazil for our future. 1% rich and 2% middle class and 98% poor.

There is no getting better when you have generations that look down on being educated, and fighting for middle class benefits.

These fiscal libertarian kooks have no real world examples of their policies working. They are just playing into the hands of rich corporations giving people hope that if they just give up their benefits things will get better.

 

1) By the Government itself when they're the ones who keep Corporations in Power, regulate the country to the state of being impossible to contend with the rest of the World and understand that the taxes imposed from the Government spending is completely unjustified for a lot of areas under the Federal Government's control.

2) Keynesian Economists believe in trickle down because it revolves around the Federal Reserve printing money and it goes to the Large Banks/Corps first than to the People. But it comes at the price of being far more devalued as it circulates further into the lower classes... this isn't a class War it is a War between Centralized Economics (Keynes/Marx) vs Austrian (Mises/Hayek). Trickle down Economics is not supported by Libertarians at all in the sense you're talking about in our current system.

3) Minority/Progressives vs Racists... Way to go creating your World of Us vs. Them when anyone who doesn't agree with you is obviously racist, hick, redneck and immoral.

 

The USA did pretty well for about the first 50 years. Self-reliance and individualism are ideals embedded in our culture. People want to succeed and pursue happiness.

Let them.

 

George Carlin explains what is going on now perfectly.

And when you listen to this....think how the Tea Party and all these cracker jack fiscal libertarian, internet forum, "economists" are just playing into the owners hand.

If I was an owner of this country.....I would be all behind the Tea Party and the Ron Paul/Libertarian kooks.


[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=acLW1vFO-2Q"]‪George Carlin ~ The American Dream‬‏ - YouTube[/ame]

 

I agree with you on that. In my opinion we should have let GM and Chrysler fail instead of rewarding them for bad management practices.

Our manufacturing history shows us that when larger corps fail someone with a better idea steps in and takes over.

 

No they aren't. you are overgeneralizing.

 

The state works more for the interests of the super wealthy than it will ever for the working poor. Free trade is the ultimate example. If the state was on the side of the working poor, protectionism never would have left. The state is for sale. Using middle class tax revenues for welfare is a way to keep unemployment numbers artificially low like using middle class tax revenue for farm subsidies is a way to keep food prices artificially high. You are the one who is duped. Don't mistake libertarians for crony capitalists a.k.a neocons.

 

it depends, if obama wins again it will really throw us towards social democracy, but if someone like ron paul or gary johnson wins then freedom will have a fighting chance. and if you want a example of libertarian policies working look at new mexico under gary johnsom.

 

The wishes of those who fund government will ultimately win the day.

 

Of course the State is owned by corporations. The voters let them do by buying into right wing ideology that bad mouths everything government attempts to do. Your Supreme Court right wingers all voted to allow unlimited corporate cash into election campaigns...all the "liberals" voted against it and for the middle class. Don't get me started on how the right wing makes up enemies foreign and domestic so as to spread fear, to take the attention off the middle class getting screwed.

 

1) By the Government itself when they're the ones who keep Corporations in Power, regulate the country to the state of being impossible to contend with the rest of the World and understand that the taxes imposed from the Government spending is completely unjustified for a lot of areas under the Federal Government's control.

2) Keynesian Economists believe in trickle down because it revolves around the Federal Reserve printing money and it goes to the Large Banks/Corps first than to the People. But it comes at the price of being far more devalued as it circulates further into the lower classes... this isn't a class War it is a War between Centralized Economics (Keynes/Marx) vs Austrian (Mises/Hayek). Trickle down Economics is not supported by Libertarians at all in the sense you're talking about in our current system.

3) Minority/Progressives vs Racists... Way to go creating your World of Us vs. Them when anyone who doesn't agree with you is obviously racist, hick, redneck and immoral.

 

You meant to say the DNC, left-liberals and progressives.

Those are the people who want to give Big Government more power over you personally.

 

I really like that clip.

 

Don't both parties do the exact same thing?

Why was Clinton in Somalia, Bosnia, Afganistan etc etc...?
Why is Obama in Libya, Yemen, Somalia, Iraq(Still?), Afganistan and Pakistan?

Why did those wearing the Proud Blue colors create, fund and support Wars that weren't necessary to the USA?

You're stuck in the Right vs. Left spinjob that the Media pushes onto the Public to create a Divide. You need to understand there isn't simply a one dimension for every person... you can agree with the Philosophy of those you label as Right Wingers in some areas. No need to get hate filled against anyone who is "Red"... Start hating Authoritarians who believe they can run your life better than you can and they'll use force to push that agenda.

 

Have you not noticed that in any decision, no matter which party is the majority, the outcome that would benefit the people always loses? Politics in America is as genuine as professional wrestling. Why do you think the "right" dupes "social conservatives" into bigger government with Christian value legislation? Because increasing the state apparatus, for the benefit of the few is always a gain. The rules of the state apparatus can always be changed with a bought vote. The size never shrinks. Whether you are a "righty" voting in larger right-wing legislation, or a "lefty" voting in larger left-wing legislation, the only thing that is for certain is no matter who is in control the few at the top are always winning. For the state apparatus, their tool, is always growing in size, and the America meant to thwart such a thing is forever shrinking into oblivion. Democrats and republicans are as different as matchbox and hotwheels. Both owned by Mattel.

 

And the NeoCon dirtbags... who can forget those loveable bunches of people screaming "ISLAMO FASCIST!".

 

This guy gets it. ^^

There are authoritarians who hate Liberty on both sides of the isle, being partisan leaves you vulnerable to one of them.

 

I have no love for left or right authoritarians.

 

I hate their ideas as much as I hate the neo-liberal tea party ideas. They are both wrong.

 

Yes I have noticed that. They lose because the only one that sticks up for the middle class are progressive/liberals in Congress. They are far outnumbered by corporatist Democrats and GOP. 100% of the GOP is rotten to the core on fiscal matters. That includes Ron Paul and his handful of others. You libertarians don't have any real world examples of your policies working. It's all a fantasy economic system in your head. You help spread corporatism by bad mouthing reasonable regulation of commerce. Government is the only tool a the middle class's disposal to spread prosperity and limit corporate greed.

 

I chose limited Government in the hopes that Americans will not become the brain dead lemmings we see in Europe, South America or Asia.

Most Americans still believe in doing things for themselves and being independent. That is a good thing.

 

It was at 50/50. Then some Mexican tipped the poll over in favor of limited government.

And I voted for Obama in 08. He betrayed me. He betrayed all of us...that are paying attention. The problem is too many of my people aren't paying attention. That means we're not loud enough. I didn't come to this country for its people to forget what made it exceptional in the first place. WE NEED TO TURN THE VOLUME UP.

 

Limited government (which is just modern conservative code for government by the rich) is insupportable in a modern world. It's simply a joke and those that propose it are either disingenuous (like Rove) or utterly ignorant (like Bachmann).

Either way, a complex economy with complex institutions in a global setting can't function without a robust public sector. The bagger course would lead to third world status.