Christianity Has Lost Its Fundamental Principle!!!

John Frum - err, I mean Jesus Christ - won't be 'returning' at all, no matter how you interpret an ancient fairytale.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Frum

 

As if I care about what you think.

 

It's clear that facts and reason don't enter into your thinking where your religion is concerned. Of course that isn't surprising, but I'm not giving up on you or anyone.

 

And its clear you did not get what I just said.

 

Luke 2:23-24 (NAB)
...And after the days of her purification, according to the law of Moses, were accomplished, they carried him to Jerusalem, to present him to the Lord: 23 As it is written in the law of the Lord: Every male opening the womb shall be called holy to the Lord: 24 And to offer a sacrifice, according as it is written in the law of the Lord, a pair of turtledoves or two young pigeons...

That would be traditional Jewish law. You know one of those 613 mitzvots (Mosaic law extended 10 x (10 x 6) +13) the matured Jesus attempted to radically clarify with the Pharisees, while essentially summarized by giving us two commandments to live by:

Luke 10:27 (NAB)
And he answered, "You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your strength, and with all your mind, and your neighbor as yourself."

Christianity didn't exist yet. It is my opinion that since the Holy Family followed Mosaic Law, Jesus would have understood Mary's sacrifice.

USCCB Commentary

[2:22] Their purification: syntactically, their must refer to Mary and Joseph, even though the Mosaic law never mentions the purification of the husband. Recognizing the problem, some Western scribes have altered the text to read “his purification,” understanding the presentation of Jesus in the temple as a form of purification; the Vulgate version has a Latin form that could be either “his” or “her.” According to the Mosaic law (Lv 12:2–8 ), the woman who gives birth to a boy is unable for forty days to touch anything sacred or to enter the temple area by reason of her legal impurity. At the end of this period she is required to offer a year-old lamb as a burnt offering and a turtledove or young pigeon as an expiation of sin. The woman who could not afford a lamb offered instead two turtledoves or two young pigeons, as Mary does here. They took him up to Jerusalem to present him to the Lord: as the firstborn son (Lk 2:7) Jesus was consecrated to the Lord as the law required (Ex 13:2, 12), but there was no requirement that this be done at the temple. The concept of a presentation at the temple is probably derived from 1 Sm 1:24–28, where Hannah offers the child Samuel for sanctuary services. The law further stipulated (Nm 3:47–48 ) that the firstborn son should be redeemed by the parents through their payment of five shekels to a member of a priestly family. About this legal requirement Luke is silent.

http://www.usccb.org/bible/luke/2/

 

While I am unfamiliar with Libhater's posts, I feel it is important to add Jesus called God His beloved Father i.e. Abba.

When a parent corrects his/her child, he/she doesn't remove LOVE from the equation. Instead the parent is nurturing his/her child.

We are expected to do the same amid our peers. We are obliged to correct or speak out against sin, even within ourselves.

 

Don't dispute that we should correct our children, nurture and guide. Dictating is where the issue lies. God never dictated but set out a path which we have a free choice to follow. Once a child is at an age of understanding it is important for them to balance out what is good and bad, based on what they have learned. Too many children have turned their back on Christianity due to ridged rules that never allow them to develop there own thinking or character. God didn't simply knock Adam and eve on the head and condemn them to death at the first point of sin. They were free to choose but had to accept any consequences due to these decisions. Too many Christians have the wrong concept of how we should look at the world like lib hater, who cuts across all that God is. Commit yourself to living Gods values and respond to all circumstances from a standpoint of love, not condemnation. He who is without sin, should cast the first stone. (What Jesus was saying was, that nobody should cast stones). He himself who was without sin, did not cast a stone. Living a life of genuine Godly love will allow people to see who God really is.

 

You're right, these are real issues, but don't represent Christianity and its belief system.

 

I always wondered about those quotes about Jesus and God in the bible, not sure how some can believe Jesus and God are one and the same


.

 

Thanks for expounding on the message I gave that with a strict interpretation of GOD's message via the parents firm upbringing of their children that they will build on that love and become loving productive individuals as they grow older. But without a love of GOD in the first place--everything else will quickly turn to pot.

 

Yes... Of all the ways this planet could have gone..
He knew that the lord of MAMMON would impose his will upon this world for a time..

It is IMPOSSIBLE to Love LOVE and GOLD at the same time..

A planet whose humans act out of LOVE.. is a planet chock full of Givers and Servants.. and therefore, of true JOY
For, this is the way that we've all yearned for things to be for our very selves all throughout our lives..

A planet whose leaders force GOLD as the be all and end all, impresses Take and Greed and Lack of Love.. as the MODUS OPERANDI between Humans
The spirit of GREED ALWAYS gives birth to LIES, SELFISHNESS, ANGER, HATRED and DEATH

You are BORN with PRO-CHOICE imbedded into your very Nature. TO Become a GIVER or a Taker..

And no one.. Not even GOD, shall ever relinquish your ever-constant choice of your very own direction - on into the Future..

+++

 

Unfortunately you still dont understand the real meaning of Godly love libhater. Your alias speaks volumes. Jesus condemned no one but those who were supposedly representing God. Even in the instance of Jesus outburst in the temple, people were using God's house to cheat and profit from others. A certain currency was required to make offering and these guys were using the guise of helping God but were in fact helping themselves.

If you pretend to be a God loving person but not demonstrating love to the world, how can you consider yourself to be a Christian? Jesus has clearly demonstrated that the church needs to keep itself in check, not those that don't believe. Stop condemning and focusing on the sins of the world and do what Jesus has commanded you to do: Love the Lord thy God....; and love thy neighbour.....

 

Humans have a tendency to only make sense out of things experienced through the use of our five senses. God exists beyond those parameters. As it was explained to me many years ago, like a diamond, God is multifaceted. There is no limit to the power of God. So for human understanding we speak of the three divine"persons" in God. The term "persons" is not used exactly in the same way we use it when speaking of a human person. We use the word for a lack of a better term. Perhaps entity or divine power would be better words, although we know Jesus existed in human form e.g. the word of God made flesh. In any case each facet of God is unique, God the Father, God the Son, God the Holy Spirit. Together each of the three facets are one in God.

The Holy Spirit is the part of God who resides in all of us. I would tell my students to think of the Holy Spirit as God's unique switchboard that keep the lines of communication open between God and each one of us. The line goes directly to our hearts. We don't see it. It is invisible but nevertheless it exists. We can feel God's Spirit working when we remain still, and unencumbered by worldly diversions. Imagine! God so loved us that He gave a part of Himself to each one of us, and when we need to talk to Him all that is needed is to speak to Him from our hearts.

Jesus the Son, was God made man. There was something about not getting the Ten Commandments straight or rather expanding the commandments to the point where the law controlled every aspect of a person's life, leaving little free will choice. I strongly believe that If God wanted obedient robots God would not have created humans. He wanted us to come to Him by the free will choices we make. Regardless, as promised, Jesus also had to fulfill scripture. It was through His perfect example we learn how to live our lives.

John 3:16 (NAB)
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.

 

Is a son not part of the seed of his father? The father will always remain part of his son, even in death.

Both my parents passed twenty three years ago. To this day I still find myself asking,"What would my mom or dad do/say in this particular situation regarding child rearing?" I don't know how many times I've said aloud, "Dad/Mom, help me out here. What would you do?" My parents were my immediate human examples of love, patience, and wisdom. It was through them I came to know God. When I'm still, the answer arrives. I just have to recall back to the day when my parents were faced with a similar situation. Calling out to them allows me to focus more clearly. Truly, wise parents are a gift from God.

 

Well said.

 

Correct....there is a time and place for making money and earning a living (the thief always sees an opportunity to cheat his customers), but God's temple was not one of them.

 

Let your light so shine before men, that they seeing your good works, will be lead to Glorify your Father, who is in Heaven.

 

Keep your nose out of other people's business. That is NOT YOUR JOB.

Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother's eye and pay no attention to the plank that is in your own eye? How can you say to your brother, 'Let me take the speck out of your eye,' when all the time there is a plank in your own eye? You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother's eye (Matthew 7:3-5).

 

Truer words were never spoken. Thank you!!

 

I am free to speak my mind. I don't walk in lock-step to the politics of this physical world.

In any case, who gave you the authority to judge me? By the same measure you judge me, so you will be judged.

 

That is a very very important part of it but Jesus also commanded His people to preach/tell people the gospel of the kingdom. And to clarify what the gospel is not: it is not Calvary nor is it telling people about Jesus or telling them to give their heart to the Lord. The gospel is about the kingdom or government of God, and He is inviting people into it to rule with Him. Much of Jesus' parables were about the kingdom of God. For example, the good master who gave his servants money to invest and when He returns he gave each of them positions of authority or ruler ship (depending on how well they did with his money) over cities in his territory. Jesus is called king of kings, because the saints the Bible says are kings. The Bible say those who overcome will inherit all things and all things includes not just the Earth, but everything that God made....the entire universe will ultimately be under our subjection.

But one cannot understand the gospel or God’s kingdom using the modern system of government that we live under. God is not into democracy……God is a Great King, and His children are to inherit all the rights of their Father in His kingdom.

 

My alias speaks volumes of my hate of liberalism and all of its destructive sister ideologies.

And like Jesus I condemn no one for being human, but I have no problem in condeming a person's belief system or ideological makeup.

Shame on them. Kind of reminds me how liberals condemn the rich and successful by getting a wealth redistribution policy enacted, and then use that ploy to empower themselves to boost their egalitarian egos.

You and I obviously have differing ideas on how one shows or gives his love to the world. I'll just leave it at that for now.

Not sure what you mean here, so I'll just let one slide as well. BTW, I'm not a member of the church-going laity.

Oh, so now I need to turn a blind eye of current terrorist threats, to worldwide Jihad, to Sharia Law, to destructive progressivism/socialism/liberalism/communism etc so as to totally concentrate of loving my neighbor and loving my GOD? Not that its any of your business as to how much and how often I take time to love my neighbor and love my GOD, but wouldn't you agree that most of we 21st century humans are capable of walking and chewing gum at the same time? Why is it all or nothing with you guys?

 

Libhater

Didn't you get the memo? You are to turn a blind eye and remain silent to the sinfulness of this physical world, in order to be assured everlasting life.

Someone needs to send the memo to the Pope, and the other heads of various religious institutions as well. Perhaps we could start with Obama's pastor, Jeremiah Wright, and the notorious Louis Farrakhan.

I'm just sayin'

 

I'm afraid that memo came during the month I was away doing missionary work. I don't have a secretary and a lot of my mail does gets lost.

 

Not judging...telling you to quit poking your nose where it's not wanted!!!

Here's judging...YOU are a hypocrite!!!

Now that is judging!!!