Islam v The United States: How To Diffuse a Political Time-Bomb

Islam is NOT monolithic!

Because of its warrior based foundation, it is one of the most conformist, intolerant and uniform perspective Religions around, which is one of the things which makes it both powerful and dangerous.

Still, it is not of solely one mind in this regard, there are subsects of Islam with truly are just a Religion, and not the over arching cultural dominating Religious-Dogma-Government-Societal Stagnation Suffocating Blanket that you are referring to...

There are a number of quiet, tolerant, accepting of differences Muslims living in both the U.S. and other Western societies.

These need to be nurtured out of from hiding, quaking in the shadowy corners, as part of the solution of the Jhihadist threat.

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Powerful figures in contemporary governments over time have used religious zeal and fervor to whip up willing martyrs to die for a cause that they have utterly no clue about the devilish genesis of..

And they've stooped many a time, I guarantee you, in the Torah, the Koran and the Bible to redacting swaths of actual revelations to skew them to their purpose of the day. Then later generations of "the faithful" perform on cue to this dark agenda introduced into the Light. You want to know where the real struggle is in this world.? There it is right there.

 

No founding father said that Islam is intolerable in America.

We know that Thomas Jefferson- who along with James Madison- helped craft Virginia's 'bill of rights' which included religious freedom- specifically included worshippers of Islam among everyone who had religious freedom.

James Madison- who is noted as the author of the Bill of Rights- believed that government has no right to tolerate- or interfere with religion- he proposed to Virginia that:


“all men are equally entitled to the free exercise of religion according to the dictates of conscience.’’

Which later was the basis for the First Amendment.


Benjamin Franklin famously stated that the standards of religious freedom in America had to be so broad that "Even if the Mufti [chief jurist] of Constantinople [from the Muslim Ottoman Empire] were to send a missionary to preach Mohammedanism to us, he would find a pulpit at his service."


When George Washington was asked in 1784 what kind of workers should be hired to work on Mount Vernon, he responded by stating that they should hire the best workers, regardless of their background: “If they are good workmen, they may be from Asia, Africa or Europe; they may be Mahometans, Jews, Christians of any sect, or they may be Atheists


Richard Henry Lee, who had made a motion in Congress on June 7, 1776, that the American colonies declare independence. "True freedom," Lee asserted, "embraces the Mahomitan and the Gentoo (Hindu) as well as the Christian religion."

Benjamin Rush, the Pennsylvania signer of the Declaration of Independence and friend of Adams and Jefferson, applauded this feature of Islam, asserting that he had "rather see the opinions of Confucius or Mohammed inculcated upon our youth than see them grow up wholly devoid of a system of religious principles."

 

With Islam they have the genesis and cause spelled out in the Koran that they are very familiar with. To "fight", "kill", "slay" and "smite the necks" of the unbelievers "until religion should only be for Allah"

 

[9.5] So when the sacred months have passed away, then slay the idolaters wherever you find them, and take them captives and besiege them and lie in wait for them in every ambush, then if they repent and keep up prayer and pay the poor-rate, leave their way free to them; surely Allah is Forgiving, Merciful.

Convert or die.

 

You have been reading the same abbreviated translation as the Rushblob and Hannity use, I see.

Surah al Baqarah:

190 And fight in the way of Allah against those who fight against you, but be not aggressive. Surely Allah loves not the aggressors.

191 And kill them wherever you find them, and drive them out whence they have driven you out, and persecution is worse than slaughter. And fight not with them at the Sacred Mosque until they fight with you in it, so if they fight you in it, slay them. Such is the recompense of the disbelievers.

192 But if they desist, then surely Allah is Forgiving, Merciful.

193 And fight them until there is no persecution, and religion is only for Allah. But if they desist, then there should be no hostility except against the oppressors.

(Translation of Maulana Muhammad Ali)

The Qur'an allows religious war only against those who attempt to oppress or eradicate Islam.

 

Completely out of context.

 

I've read the entire Koran and most hadiths. All the quoted words have been read within the context of the Koran
http://quod.lib.umich.edu/k/koran/simple.html
Read all the verses regarding when believer is commanded to "fight", "kill", "slay" and "smite the necks" of the unbelivers

 

My views alone ? LOL. I can see you've been sheltered in a very pro-Islam environment. Time to step into the light. Most people around the world don't accept Islam to be a religion. Here's a small sample.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islam_in_Italy

http://blogs.ssrc.org/tif/2010/07/28...ot-a-religion/

http://www.canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/27211

http://atlasshrugs2000.typepad.com/a...ax-status.html

http://thepatriotfactor.blogspot.com...-religion.html

http://www.amazon.com/Allah-Is-Dead-.../dp/0578073900

http://catchkevin.com/islam-not-protected/

http://beforeitsnews.com/internation...y-2451630.html

http://www.islamreview.com/articles/...religion.shtml

http://avideditor.wordpress.com/2008...mplete-system/

http://www.awsg.us/islam-is-not-a-religion/

http://www.danielpipes.org/comments/205742

http://www.thecatholicthing.org/colu...-religion.html

https://sites.google.com/site/islami...tical-ideology

http://gatesofvienna.blogspot.com/20...-religion.html

 

This is one of the Islamapologist primary tactics. All together they are >>

1. Interpretation

2. Out of context

3. Invalidation

And they rarely come up with anything new. Ho hum.

Invalidation is hardwired into Islamapologists.

That should be everyone in the world.

 

The following were YOUR words, not mine >> "After a long and bitter debate, Jefferson's statute for religious freedom passed the state legislature. In Jefferson's words, there was now "freedom for the Jew and the Gentile, the Christian and the Mohammedan,..."

OK so who were those founding fathers in the state legislature who opposed Jefferson in that "long and bitter debate" ? Or perhaps they were debating about what kind of coffee to drink ?

And how amazing that you continue to try to use Thomas Jefferson as a tool to try to validate Islam, when I already completely eliminated that lame notion in Post # 234.

 

Separation of Church and State... the best answer to it all.

 

Maintain "Separation of Church and State" and America will be okay. Stray from that and people WILL be oppressed by religion.

 

Lefty It is you who fail to understand Islam and it's pernicious doctrine of abnegation. In order to understand what version of Islam a man follows one must first no the hadiths through which he interprets it...

Why is that? Because even on the most basic points of Dogma the Koran as written by Mohammed contradicts itself with amazing frequency. It is through the hadiths that which is to be considered true and which to be ignored and at what time and place is to be found.

 

I sympathize with what you say and agree mostly but I would say those who are quiet, tolerant, accepting of differences, are thereby not Muslims (no matter what they may call themselves)... Muslims by definition, by the Koran, are warmongering, intolerant, and accepting of nothing at all except Islam.

 

The Qur'an makes it specific which unbelievers are to be punished a few verses later:

9:12

 

Not all that old.
This pretty much started in the 1970s as a result of US support for Israel and other interference in Islamic areas.
Basically, your leaders started something but had no clue what they were doing.
Before that, there was nothing against any western country (unless you want to count the Barbary pirates as the desperate usually do).

 

The Koran is loaded with suras/verses calling for genocidal mass murder of infidels. I also contains advocacies of supremacism, wife-beating, severe discrimination against women, rape, pedophilia, slavery, torture/mutilation, animal cruelty, etc. In short, the Koran is a book filled with unconstitutional supremacism, sedition, and numerous violations of US law. Anyone who would defend this satanic atrocity is either a deranged Muslim, or just simply deranged.

 

Church and state are one and the same in Islam. The rule of the Islamic Caliphates from 632 to the 1920s is the norm for Islam. The last 90 years the exception.

 

No, just one example of the many unbelievers that are to be fought against. As far as idolaters, "wherever you find them"

 

Started long before that.

 

"Islam" is NOT a country... it is a religion.

And as long as the human spirit exists, there will be nations like ours where 'religion' will not be allowed to be forced upon people. Some claiming to be "Islamic" are fighting a battle they WILL NOT WIN; that is because they are fighting HUMANITY itself. That will never just lay down and die; I'm certain of it.

Here, we can avoid a host of problems with 'religion' by adamantly maintaining, "Separation of Church and State".

 

Islam doesnt recognize national boundries. There is only Dar al-harb and Dar al-Islam

 

Well, you can obsess and grovel in paranoia over "Islam" if you want; but I KNOW that the human race is NOT going to be overrun by any one particular religion or ...ism. This whole thing (mankind) would burn to the ground, before that is allowed to happen.

Until then... lets diligently maintain, the "Separation of Church and State".

 

I'll wait here while you scurry off to slay that strawman.