"Under God"... should be removed from the "Pledge"

As a Christian, I'm never going to be okay with pledging allegiance to a flag in the first place.

 

Didn't say it was...

Nobody is forced to say "under God"...

In fact, please, point me to one example of any child anywhere being disciplined for refusing to say under God...

This is merely more adults using children to score political points, and it's disgusting...

EDIT: There is a case of one 17-year old in Palm Beach County being belittled and disrespected in front of his class by one idiot math teacher when he stated that he would not stand and recite the Pledge...

He was berated and told he was "unpatriotic..."

 

My good Brother, Red Skelton, says it well:

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TZBTyTWOZCM"]Red Skelton - Pledge of Allegiance[/ame]

 

If there is separation of state and church, there should be. And from the moment that in the state you introduce references to God, you are puting together Church and state.

 

Big shocker there! At least you're consistent. Now you should team up with that other unpatriotic idiot...obama. BTW, is there an all-Muslim flag you two could salute? Perhaps a little kneeling down facing Mecca would do the trick.

 

Pleaser quote the part of the Constitution that states that we are a secular nation.

You forgot all about this little declaration.


When in the course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain inalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.


The very first Amendment to the Constitution does not separate church and state but forbids the state from separating us from the church as Obama is trying to do right now. The progressives want to push morality and self control to the side and pander to the lust, jealousy and self gratification that tempts all men.

But these rotten planks in the dem platform cannot be built into a strong nation. The rotted wood will crumble and the people will fall into despair - still blaming those who have.

Guess what? The haves will still be the same people but there will be a bigger population of have-nots. The liberal horde will pull down the upper middle class but they will never touch the people that they hate the most.

GOD is nothing more than a symbol of truth, love and personal responsibility of which the liberal horde knows nothing and will never learn because they can grasp the concepts.

 

I'll spell this for you, liberal:

NO, IT DOES NOT, and I will NOT have liberals trying to destroy my country and my way of life by claiming otherwise.

You would know nonsensical. Very well. If a parent does not wish their child to recite the Pledge of Allegiance, it is the right and responsibility of that parent to make their wishes clear.

You have a point in one - and only one - circumstance: if a school mandates that a child recite such a thing REGARDLESS of what a parent wants.

Beyond that, get your NOSE out of my WAY of LIFE.

 

A Christian does not put their addled view of law ahead of their Christianity.

 

Exactly!

 

LOL the constitution is not meant to be taken word for word, that is why there is a supreme court. Which has ruled we are secular. Don't like it? Too (*)(*)(*)(*)ing bad its NEVER going to change. 95% of America does not want any form of religion in government AT ALL. Take your theocracy and get the (*)(*)(*)(*) out of my secular country.

 

Its just the leftist Religious Atheist Fundamentalists who want their religion as the state religion. Nothing more.

 

Yes remove it. Any religious view should not be endorsed by the government. Get rid of "In God We Trust" from our money as well.

 

I don't see anyone saying we should put "god doesn't exist" all over our currency and in our pledge of allegiance. Rather people are saying they don't want anyones religion in government.

 

___Amen.___

 

You are incorrect.

 

Yes, indeed. If a person is "spiritual" or has a closely held belief... they are free to practice or believe... as long as they don't 'compel' others to endure the same.

And once you put "Government" into the mix (such as having a whole school recite a pledge with clearly RELIGIOUS references built into it... with an agent of the STATE leading the same), there is no longer "separation" (or regarding of the rights of those children and parents not wishing to subjected to that said tradition or rule).

 

The only way around that is to not send them to public schools.

Why is there not a poll option to get rid of "the pledge" altogether? Especially since people seem to be so worried about "indoctrination".

 

No. Simply stop subjecting them (daily, in particular) to what is "religious". It's not that hard to do.

I'm for things which are most 'inclusive'; subjecting people (or their children) to religion they'd prefer to be 'free' of... is the problem.

How important is it, that we keep the words "...under God..." in the Pledge of Allegiance, or require it to be recited as a group in classrooms?

What good/bad does that do?

 

You can do that and children will still be indoctrinated at school. If you don't see that basic truth then perhaps you should take a step back and reevaluate the situation.

And what of the parents that would prefer their children to be free of that pervasive religion known as blind nationalism?

It isn't important at all. How important is it that we keep "the pledge" itself....or require it to be recited as a group in classrooms? What sense does it make to have kids pledge loyalty to things that they have no concept of yet? It seems to me that you aren't worried about "indoctrination" as much as you are about one very specific and relatively minor type of indoctrination.

 

New nominee for the stupidest post of the year. You're in the lead.

There is no form of religion in Government. Free expression of the people is not the same thing as a Government expressing a religion.

Actually, take your desire to suppress the free expression of religion of the people, and get the fock out of my country.

 

This attitude is part of THE problem addressed by this thread (and in America today); while certainly nothing new, illustrates the reason(s) we have to go to court about such matters.

 

Your poll is biased. Where is the "Don't care because Pledge should be abolished from public schools" button?

 

I just don't see the need to take it to court...

"Under God" can be omitted if a student so chose...

Also, one could just not say the Pledge at all, if they didn't want to...

No disciplinary actions would stand up for long...

 

What if those kids started ADDING things (aloud, to replace) rather than 'omitting' those words? If THAT began happening nationwide, I bet you'd see my point more clearly. In fact, I'm going to work on re-writing that "Pledge" and ask my political representative about considering such changes as I might suggest.

There is NO NEED to say the Pledge daily at all. What is the purpose of requiring student to recite it? I'm in the military, and while I tend to pray frequently at times to bolster my spiritual strength, but I'm sure the atheists and others around me would not value hearing the Chaplain go on-and-on... about his specific beliefs. I understand that "God" is deeply important to many Americans... but it isn't right to DAILY subject certain students in various classrooms to a tradition which they cannot fully relate to; not to mention that it likely alienates them.

A moment/period of silence or personal reflection would be far better.

Just let the kids be 'quiet'; mandating that the Pledge be recited (in general by the school system) isn't necessary, so leave it out. It's okay to TEACH or TEACH ABOUT it... but reciting it daily as a group isn't efficacious.

As I said, I want atheist kids and others to start REPLACING the words, to drive the point home.

 

As long as it is said and I am saying it, it will be part of it.